This week on Margin Call we welcome our old friend Albert back to the show to discuss the status of distance learning in California as the state moves to begin reopening schools.
[00:00:00] Eming: [00:00:00] Greetings and welcome to margin call .The podcast and editorial meeting for Kwest on media. I’m your host Eming Piansay , today we have a old friend on the show when we haven’t seen, I don’t even know. I think , he was on when we were still using Google Hangouts to record our episodes back back in the day, Albert Felipe one of my dearest oldest.
[00:00:35] Most headiest thinking talky people that I know, , is, is on today because , when I call out into the universe and I’m like, does anyone want to come on the show this week? His hand has reached up through my inbox and he says, me me. And I’m like, Great because I haven’t talked to him in like three years.
[00:00:54] So this is, this is a great time to catch up in a short amount of time. But the topic today we [00:01:00] wanted to talk about, I want to talk about was the fact that California specifically. Is, , we are getting our vaccines for COVID slowly, but surely people are slowly, you know, get getting them. And now people are discussing sending children back to school.
[00:01:18] And as a parents, Albert, again, thank you for coming on the show. Appreciate you. And all you do.
[00:01:26] You’re a parent, you have two children. One is 17 in high school. I’m assuming. And I don’t know the age of your daughter. She is how old?.
[00:01:34] Albert: [00:01:34] She’s actually three going to be four next week. Right. And she just started virtual early headstart, which is interesting too.
[00:01:48] Eming: [00:01:48] Yeah. So how are you feeling about this? I mean, I know I personally, I worked in a school for like three years and my initial feeling was like, kids don’t know how to keep [00:02:00] their distance. Like kids get lice all the time at school. How can, like, how can they even like, like even try to incorporate kids back into school with COVID knowing that they’re like, you know, they’re touch things.
[00:02:14] They want to be into their friends. They want to be like, As a parent, how do you feel about that? That the state is really like gung ho on getting kids back to school by may, which I find kind of ridiculous, but yeah.
[00:02:27] Albert: [00:02:27] Which is really interesting. And, you know, thanks for always go ahead and sending out the invites.
[00:02:31] I’m glad to join you guys . I really got excited when I saw this topic, because I think like, you know, since I now have , a daughter that’s in this process of, you know, me and my wife are actually having these discussions daily about whether we want to send our child’s, um, back to school or not.
[00:02:49] So I think like, yeah, it is kind of like this whole , This whole, really rethinking of what we’re really looking at and prioritizing when it comes down to [00:03:00] education and our children. Right. Um, in my own experience. And I think like, , while I don’t have the facts to back this up, but I’m pretty sure this right.
[00:03:08] Like, you know, one of the major concerns, especially when you. Go back to school. It’s just like, especially for young children. And I’m really speaking in the context of my daughter. Um, you know, it’s a very vulnerable state for a lot of young people, especially in early childhood, but I’m also thinking about kindergarteners and first graders, because technically, right, like, um, legally you’re supposed to have.
[00:03:30] Children enrolled in school during this time. Right. And , but in-person instruction is definitely kind of like a , a risk. Right. And, and I think like, you know, in any aspect of education, I mean, one of the top priorities for , these, you know, institutions to take on is. Um, health risks and health factors.
[00:03:53] Right , we know that, especially for a young kids , they’re susceptible to a lot of things, [00:04:00] um, in the classroom, because again, I only think about these , small little, um, preschool classrooms where you constantly have to disinfect and bleach it. Everything almost on a daily basis because of course kids get sick so much, especially during those stages of life.
[00:04:18] And now with the pandemic which really brings up this really big red flag. Right. , It was automatic to go ahead and say, yeah, you stopped schools. You started. But all of a sudden, I feel like this, , this rush to get , children back in school. , I don’t think we’re really being honest. I, I think systemically , the way that this is being looked at, I think it’s more of a pressure rather than let’s really come up with real solutions to how do we safely bring children back into classrooms that whole term, how do we safely bring children back to classrooms?
[00:04:53] I think there’s a little bit more of a thought process that needs to happen rather than just kind of [00:05:00] like a topic of discussion and you know. Oh, well it’s going to happen anyway. So let’s just figure it out , it’s a little bit deeper than that.
[00:05:08] Eming: [00:05:08] Right. So why do you personally think that that it’s being pushed so hard right now?
[00:05:12] Like, what do you think is the, is the reasoning behind the governments and the schools? Why, why
[00:05:20] Albert: [00:05:20] to me, in my own opinion, I think it’s like, , uh, It’s almost like a herd of sheep. Um, and we just have to flock um, and what do I mean? Right. What do I really mean by that? I really think that there’s a lot more pressure on them, political and a , other agendas.
[00:05:38] I don’t know whether it’s private agendas. I don’t know. If it’s corporations, I don’t, I don’t know exactly, but I do know that there are other agendas behind this push. And the majority of that I think would be politically, right. I think like when you feel pressures, um, politically I think sometimes, you know, you need to kind on like , just say.
[00:05:59] Yeah. You know , we [00:06:00] need to safely reopen because the kids matter, but I think that’s an easy cop-out right. I really think it has to do with funding in some given ways. Right. , it being in the realm of, of nonprofits for a very long time, you know, when, fiscal years and years come in, you know, There’s an idea that, that goes out, that, you know, well, if you don’t spend the money, you’re going to lose it.
[00:06:22] Right. So if you think about it, if we’re not using the budgets lines in education, you know, on a yearly basis, there is a risk that you take on losing a lot of that funding. So if the lights aren’t on and you’re not paying that light bill, right. , do you really need the light you’re in the center of the thing.
[00:06:42] So, so, you know, and I’m just using that as kind of like, you know, if there is an , an empty space of, you know, of just like a big building that is not being utilized right. Nine times out of 10, you know, you question whether it’s needed or not. And I think that’s the stage that we’re at. Right. , so I really feel like those agendas are [00:07:00] prioritizing a lot more than just the health and safety of individuals.
[00:07:05] Eming: [00:07:05] Right. So as a parent, what would you like to see? Like how would this work out in a way where you would feel comfortable slowly, eventually allowing your kids to reenter a classroom
[00:07:16] Albert: [00:07:16] I was thinking like, you know , I think, you know, this, I think we’ve discussed this, but you know, um, part of my journey and my life’s journey was just going back to school at later on in my life. Right. So I actually went back to college to go ahead and finish my undergrad. And one of the things that I was really, intimidated by, but actually found very , Comforting was a hybrid model.
[00:07:41] Okay. And what I mean by hybrid model is that, you know, you do have in-person instruction, but you know, you also have this virtual kind of like realm, right , the first thing you really need to do is really make all parents feel comfortable about the decisions that they’re making, that their children are [00:08:00] really being prioritized and being viewed.
[00:08:03] in a way where , their needs are being met first , and what do I mean by that, that you really need to make parents feel comfortable in the idea that when they go into in-person learning, I think like that’s where you want to really focus in on. They all have vaccinations for a, I’m talking about teachers, staff, everybody is a work in, in the school need to have access to the vaccine. .
[00:08:32] Right? You can deal with individual perceptions while they go, but that should be like the first priority. If you want to come back, these are the things that you need to do , of course you have to move the classrooms. And, but the thing is, is just like, I’m not even talking about like. Almost like a, and I know this is impossible in some systems, but it’s still something you have to throw on the table, but, you know, limit classroom sizes to almost like, you know, six children per classroom, [00:09:00] almost to a point.
[00:09:01] Right. And you would have to stagger that during the week. You know what I’m saying? Like, if you’re doing a hybrid model, then you know what, you can have a, you know, 10 kids in the classroom, but technically it would be two separate classrooms with five in each classroom and then alternate kids and students, you know, during the week that way, again, to really incorporate this hybrid model.
[00:09:20] Because again, if we’re really trying to go ahead and push that everybody shouldn’t be back in in-person learning then guess what? these are the things that you need to do. You need to secure. Um, parents’ comfortability of really , allowing children to go back, really have a detailed plan of how you’re really like doing, and getting rid of all the health, um, concerns, you know, again with like wiping down and things like that.
[00:09:44] and, and definitely like, Providing them with an accurate plan of what would happen if things don’t go the way. So yeah, that hybrid model, I think, is something that needs to happen.
[00:09:57] Eming: [00:09:57] Right. I’m curious we’re [00:10:00] approaching, I think it’s the year mark, since school’s closed for me, it was the 13th of March last year.
[00:10:05] But I’m curious, you said your daughter is, uh, beginning to do like, um, online learning of sorts. And your son is , in high school. How has that been going for them this past year? How have they. I keep seeing things like about, about, kids, like, really like reaching a point of like, we are so sick of this, like this online education thing isn’t working for us.
[00:10:28] Like we really want to like, be back with our classmates and our, and our teacher. How have they been, been dealing with this?
[00:10:36] Albert: [00:10:36] Yeah. You know? Um, so I’ll start with my daughter. I think, um, what’s interesting is that this is, um, her first realms of education. So there’s going to be interesting to see how she goes forward with it.
[00:10:47] Right. Because I think like, you know, while, she just started her virtual, right. And she only gets about like an hour or two hours a day virtually this is going to be her normal way of how education starts. So it’s going to be interesting to [00:11:00] see, you know, once in-person starts for her. Like how that’s really going to be, inceptionalized and how she’s going to think going forward with education.
[00:11:10] Right. I know I’m able to participate way more in her education while we’re home, because obviously, you know, While you’re doing that, you know, parent parent support now is just automatic. You know, it’s not like left wondering when children go to school and then come back, you know, we go into our routines, but I think now I see myself way more involved and I’m, and I’m a very involved parent, but I think like now I find myself really, even more involved because it’s at home.
[00:11:42] Right. So just kind of like that shift now. What’s interesting about my son. He’s a senior in high school. And what’s interesting is that when the pandemic did happen, he was lagging a little bit, when it came down to like, you know, there was a question whether he was going to graduate or not, which I thought was really interesting, [00:12:00] you know what I’m saying?
[00:12:02] Because you know, he’s a smart kid, you know, everybody says that about the kids, but, you know, I think like he’s, he’s a very smart kid, but, you know, we were just like giving them like a lot of shit about it, you know? Once the pandemic happened, man, there was a shift. So it was interesting to read all these reports of just like , you know, kids who were kind of like lagging.
[00:12:22] But what’s interesting with him is that he actually saw an increase in his grades and, um, actually like the risk of him not graduating, just kind of like. Dissipated. So I don’t know if the factor was the pandemic was so brand new and everything, you know, kind of like culminated and everything, but he actually kind of like got out of that red zone.
[00:12:42] Right. Because, and when I asked him it was, he said that he’s way more comfortable with the aspect of virtual learning and being given these assignments and doing so, you know, I think that was also a direct reflection of kind of like his character and his personality on how he. [00:13:00] Enjoyed teaching because, pre pandemic, um, what we would hear from him it’s is just like, Oh, this teacher, I don’t really understand her.
[00:13:10] She frustrates me. He frustrates me, you know, he gets her all. But what was interesting is that as we saw the shift and then instead of focusing on the teacher, he was focusing on the work. Right. So I think that really added a benefit him and his character and his personality, because I guess the engagement of the teachers on a, I guess on a personal level, right?
[00:13:36] Was taken out. And that would be, is able to allow it and focus on the work. And I guess that. Helped him. So now, you know, we’re just like, and it’s funny, cause now we’re like me and his mother are just complaining about damn. Now we’re going to have to have a virtual graduation and we really wanted to have an in-person graduation, but yeah,
[00:13:57] Eming: [00:13:57] that’s a bummer.
[00:13:58] But, I’m [00:14:00] assuming, do you like have friends who have kids who are in the same kind of boat as you are? . Do you know, if they have like, have they also been like, you know, going up or down, like how has their, time been with, with this pandemic education in home
[00:14:16] learning situation?
[00:14:17] Albert: [00:14:17] You know, uh, in my wife’s family, we have a lot of like, middle school, um, uh, probably like, I think one high school student and then a couple of like post high school, like, students as well. And you know, what’s interesting is that, um, when I do see them, I see them and they’re always carrying their materials with them.
[00:14:41] Which I thought was interesting because I think like, I guess, I mean, like
[00:14:45] when they’re just out in the world like just holding their materials,
[00:14:48] they have like their laptop and their books. And for me, I’m a very visual person. So it’s interesting. Cause now I see them like even on [00:15:00] our time when it’s personal, They’re carrying their stuff with them, which I thought was interesting.
[00:15:04] Right. I was just like this. I was like, so what are you, why are you walking around? Why are we walking around with your laptop? And it’s like, Oh, I got to class. Oh, I got to go to school. And I’m like, and this is even the middle school kids. And I thought that was interesting, right. Because it was just like, Oh shit.
[00:15:17] You know, like, this is really kind of like. Interesting, at least in that realm of just looking like, even that, you know, my, my daughter’s eight year old cousin who was walking around with an iPad and, and, you know, you associated it, like, you know, they’re gonna go ahead, they’re gonna play some games on their apps, but then she was just like, yeah.
[00:15:35] But then, you know, sometimes I have homework on there and I was like, Oh shit, that’s cool too. Right. So it’s interesting. Cause now I’ve seen people, you know, at least kids walking around with their devices, which I thought was interesting, you know, at least, at least from my experience.
[00:15:49] Eming: [00:15:49] Yeah, that, that makes me wonder, like, obviously you’re on people who are, have really like, just dived in to this, to this, at-home learning situation, but it makes me wonder, is [00:16:00] there now this like weird, like divide of like people who are going up, people are going down and it’s like, you know, there’s no way to like, Fix it or do anything because it’s all stuck in this vortex of pandemic education.
[00:16:12] That’s really interesting to me. Yeah.
[00:16:13] Albert: [00:16:13] And to me, I think it is too, because we actually were talking about that as far as a work hybrid. Right. Because as you can tell what remote work is. So actually going through this thing where now we’re seeing companies who are just abandoning kind of like brick and mortar and going completely virtual, right.
[00:16:28] Our organization right now is going through that right now, where. You know, remotely, we’re actually downsizing our space and everything else, because I think people are choosing, or, you know, the way of the universe is really like pushing these things about how we work . I feel education is going through that same thing, right.
[00:16:47] Where education is now being looked at where, okay, there is this kind of like weird shifts, right? Like, like the fork in the road is happening. Like all of a sudden now we’re realizing some of these things can be done virtually. [00:17:00] Right and maybe we can go ahead and, you know, take out some of these other elements that one have money attached to them.
[00:17:11] And two, because I think that’s always the bottom line, right? Like, I think like, uh, now this technology has really caused the shift of us looking at these things and actually creating that fork where now things feel kind of like weird. Because I think you’re taking away the personal aspect of it.
[00:17:33] Right. You’ve taken, you’ve taken away that interaction, that person to person interaction. Right. So now how are we supposed to survive without that? And again, the reference to demolition man is real for me. You know what I’m saying? Like, you know, you and I were talking about that earlier about how, like, I feel like demolition man was kind of like a, you know, a starter kit, what the world would do.
[00:18:00] [00:17:59] Eming: [00:17:59] Right. Well, I don’t want to hold you back too long. I know you’ve got to go, but my, I guess my last question for you is, um, as, as California itself is preparing to potentially have kids go back to school, even though I, I don’t whatever, but what do you think will be like the, the future of education? If COVID is like, still going to be sort of like.
[00:18:25] Around in various forms. Like what do you foresee being the, the, the end game of this whole situation?
[00:18:32] Albert: [00:18:32] No. Yeah. I mean, first of all, I don’t feel that we are ready. Right. So I don’t know how many parents would feel the same way, but again, like we’re only a year into this thing. We haven’t even learned.
[00:18:43] Enough about, you know, the aftermath to really kind of like make these decisions. I think, again, the decision, really being made on another level where it’s just like, no, we just gotta get through it. We just gotta go forward. You know, Dr. Fauci has always, you know, who I, you know, Really intrust [00:19:00] in just understanding what this is about, because I mean the math studies and everything in, you know, everybody may have their opinion, but yeah, I believe we’re still at the infancy of this thing was like, we don’t know what the long lasting effects are, California reopening the school.
[00:19:13] It was just, I think again, a very like, Immediate move is just like, based more on the following. Like again, like we need to go ahead and go forward without really , like having a good strategy around it. So I don’t think, like, I know as a parent, I’m not going to go ahead and just fall in line. No, that, and my wife, I’ve talked about, like, you know, we’re going to take our precautions because obviously we can’t let these systems take those precautions for the safety of our children.
[00:19:43] Um, I don’t, I don’t know who’s going to get the vaccine. I don’t know. Who’s rejecting the vaccine. I don’t know. Who’s what people’s personal beliefs might interfere with the safety of my child, which as a parent, I feel like, you know, this is what we do. We, we have to [00:20:00] take that into consideration and not really rely on systems to really kind of like, hold that.
[00:20:04] Right. So I know my wife and I are taking on the responsibility of just what that is and, you know, the school system. So I’m really going to have to deal with that. You know, um, they’re going to have to shift, they’re going to have to shift regardless. They’re going to have to assist with our level of thinking, you know, um, regardless of how technology pushes it or anything, education, one of the more important pieces of education is the focus on parents.
[00:20:35] All right. Teachers. I know teachers have always said that as far as like involving them in decisions, but now I feel like more so that involvement with parents is just now going to be zeroed in a little bit more because you could see that it’s being split. There are parents who want their kids in school.
[00:20:55] And I hate to say this. Those people who want those children, kids in school, [00:21:00] I would question what their priorities are, why they want their kids in school. You know,
[00:21:08] we know that some parents choose to send kids to school because they don’t have no forms of babysitting or of anybody taking care of the children, which is fair to say. But you know, those things have to be evaluated a little bit more with a, with a focus. So I know where I’m going. I know I’m putting that pressure, you know, but.
[00:21:30] Eming: [00:21:30] Yes. We know how you’d be like, no, no, no, no, no, not my child, not my child. I’m not exposing them to no COVID no, no, no, no. Yes, yes. Yes.
[00:21:46] Thank you again so much for coming on and squeezing in between your, your life of children and work and, .
[00:21:53] Albert: [00:21:53] Yeah. It’s, it’s funny because now, you know, how about what we’ve spoken about, like [00:22:00] mental health, uh, and, and just an advocate for it. But here’s the thing we’re all living through a very like traumatic time. So it’s really interesting that we now have to like, kind of like take care of ourselves. So I just say, remember, keep your sanity intact because don’t make these people in the education system go make you go crazy. Right? Cause it’s not, you always have like the upper hand in this.
[00:22:22] Eming: [00:22:22] Wise words wise words from an always very wise, man. Thank you again. We hope we have you on in the future
[00:22:31] Albert: [00:22:31] definitely we’ll make it. We’ll make it a little bit more frequent than the less, you know, constrictive timelines.
[00:22:39] Eming: [00:22:39] Okay. Well again, thank you for joining us or joining me or joining our audience today and thanks for our supporters and listeners.
[00:22:45] I hope you guys enjoyed this thoughtful insight into education during the pandemic. Um, thank you again, and we’ll see you guys next time. Kwest On everyone.. This episode. Kwest on media is margin. Call was produced in Richmond, [00:23:00] California.
